@Bronugget
Just to leave a bit of information. First is while providing AI protections is what SAG wants wants and is fantastic and needed, the way that they're doing it is quite bad. The current agreement if signed would force them (Hoyo in this case) to repace all non-union based voice actors on union projects. This is an issue because unions require buy ins that smaller studios and/or lesser known voice actors cant afford easily. Another thing is the studio that handles zenless zone zero does have AI protections (which is why the studio is well liked) but they aren't union enforced and therefore "not good enough" in a way for the agreement. Lycaon and S11's voice actors willingly withheld their voice with the understanding that they could be recast eventually if they choose not to return. It was a moral decision compared to leaving your job in solidarity. This was not protestingfor the strike because studio's cannot recast actors for striking. So while a bummer, recasting was involved because those characters are relevant to the story and Hoyo made the call. This situation sucks because while AI protections are absolutely needed. The way the SAG union is trying to give them is scummy and them trying to create a monoply in the voice acting space by forcing studios to only use union talent and not allowing non-union talent to work on union projects. This is the reason they aren't immediately signing the deal. This is what I found researching the situation. Apologies for the paragraphs
@Zakkun1
Just adding what I've learned on the subreddit here. Hoyoverse hired an American VA studio (Sound Cadence) to handle the EN dubbing. Sound Cadence is currently non-union, but claims to have it's own AI protections and many other VAs have spoken up to vouch for them after this debacle. So it's not entirely on Hoyoverse and the situation is pretty messy. There has also been some talk about the SAG-AFTRA being perhaps too monopolized being basically the only VA union and charging pehaps too much to join. Meaning some lower end VAs may not be able to afford it and want to take non-union roles. I'm no expert though so do your own research. I hate AI as much as the next guy, so hopefully this gets sorted sooner rather than later.
@Nephanor
Okay, this topic has come up again, and I am gonna point out some stuff that a LOT of people aren't talking about, and some things that another YTer who has the biggest hate boner for AI I've ever seen pointed out and had to concede on. 1. The union is MAINLY filled with Hollywood actors and run by them, the VAs are basically second class citizens in the guild. 2. Hollywood HATES video gaming, because of the fact that video gaming has overtaken movies as the #1 entertainment medium in the early 2000's. In 2007, video game revenu was $41.9 billion and the global box offive was $26.7 billion 3. Hollywood HATES that it is becoming irrelevant, and this has bred some serious resentment of Hollywood towards video games, which is rapidly taking over as the main cultural driving force from Hollywood These points alone show that Hollywood has reason to want to sabotage video games. 4. The union is used to dealing with movie studios, which are like 5 or 6 companies, and easy to negotiate with, since the union holds all the cards, without the actors, there are no movies 5. Video games are NOT contained to AAA game companies, which makes bargaining MUCH harder, since getting ALL of them to agree is near impossible, especially with the rise of indy studios 6. Voice acting, while it is MUCH better when done by a professional actor is NOT the main focus of many games, and can be done by lower end, non union folks for cheaper, and good gameplay can carry a game entirely with subpar voice acting, something movies cannot do. Any one bad thing can ruin a movie, but video games can be saved if they just have good gameplay. 7. As mentioned by others, the union wants to force non-union VAs out of work, and that's one of the things they are demanding from game studios in the main agreement, that if a studio signs the main agreement, they CANNOT have non-union actors working with union ones. These points show that the union is not in the best position during this strike, and is facing a HUGE hurdle.... Video games are advancing to the point where large language models can start generating text of characters in games so you can literally have interactive NPCs that are WAY more interactive than some script, and that REQUIRES the ability to generate voice acting on the fly and likely from AI voice models. This means the DEMAND for AI voices is growing in video games because it is just SO BLOODY USEFUL. Sure, it isn't the best at this point, but 5 years ago, it wasn't even as good as it is today. In 5 more years, it will likely be fully developed. Now, to be clear, I SUPPORT the VAs getting paid properly for their work. I am friends with many VAs and want them to be paid properly, and if they WANT to be used for training an AI, I want them to have control over how it is used and when and be paid properly for it. That is fair and just. But the problem is, the situation is a complete disaster. The union is run by people who hate video games, don't know how to negotiate with game studios, and came into the demand WAY too late in the development of the tech. They are fighting an uphill battle against an entrenched opponent who already is outgunning them, and using tactics which aren't effective. And to be honest, they likely don't even care if they win, since they wouldn't be bothered if video games never got another union actor working for them ever again, thinking this may hurt video game revenue, and put the film industry back on top. This whole situation is garbage, and I hope it can be resolved so the VAs can go back to work, but I feel that the union is the problem. They either need a new union for JUST VAs, or they need to have more say in how it's run.
@ShOwOba
Oh, old Lycaon, my beloved... Always gave me shivers when I heard his lines, but the new VA? He serves the job just fine in the plot, but DO NOT compare the new ult lines to the old ones.
@TylerTraverse
The "replacements" are now the permanent actors. If the agreement is ever signed, that wouldn't mean the originals come back.
@Beowulfgang_Amadeus
A few points, and some hard truths: 1.) Replacing real voice actors with Generative AI slop is disgusting profit-based money grubbing. 2.) As AI generation improves, less and less roles will be available for real VAs. 3.) If you choose not to work due to a strike/based on contract details, you are not and will never be guaranteed your position unless somehow your contract with the company in question allows it. (It won't) D.) If you choose to be a scab, you accept the possibility that when the strike is resolved and the contract dispute ends, you may be replaced rather unceremoniously. We've been here before. We've seen union strikes and worker walkouts before, and we will continue to see them. Generative AI is awful for these talented individuals because of all the same reasons it's so attractive to their employers. I suspect that eventually, the talent will lose, which is a sad but harsh reality.
@GrapeSoda1515
The whole VA situation is really unfortunate and I'm hoping it does get resolved in a way its positive for everyone. But it's crazy to me how Soldier 11's VA goes about this very professionally, understanding the results of said strike on her role. However Lycaons VA bad mouths Hoyo and Sound cadence saying they didn't communicate with him and that he's been fully available for recording. To which, Sound cadence then had to release a statement addressing how they communicate their artists, disproving his claim. Lycaon's VA then did a 180 after Soldier 11's VA posted, he retweeted her statement of which he claimed he's been quiet about the strike which he "apparently" supports despite not being in the union so he must've lied about being "available" and just kept quiet despite the studios reaching out to him. Other VA's who've worked with sound cadence also started rebutting Lycaons VA complaints informing him of their incredible experience working with them, it just screams unprofessionalism with how he's spreading misinformation and shifting blame around to whatevers convenient for the story. Good thing studious and VA's will steer clear of him now though.
@OutlawViIe
The way SAG-AFTRA is manipulating genuine concerns over AI Voice model training protections, in order to monopolize the Voice Acting Studios, is frankly disgusting. Leaving an extremely limited carve out for non-Union VA's that expires after a very short amount of performances, then requiring them [the studio] to either stop working with the VA, or force the VA to join the Union is disgusting. I'm all for VA's and all actors having autonomy and control over their voices, bodies and performances; but the way SAG-AFTRA is now trying to fatten themselves off this movement just because it actually gained steam, is shameful. Imagine trying to say you care about VA's right to fair wages, while simultaneously giving an ultimatum to these large studios that if they want to work with you, they have to FIRE all Non-Union VA's.
@gamecubegll
Thanks for giving awareness to this problem. I really hope it gets resolved because in the long term, i have the feeling the players (of any game) might just suffer from it. Not to mention the voice acting industry. Thank you very much <3
@JoseGarcia-fe8bq
Thanks for the info I play in JP VA for the game cause I prefer it but it sucks that the English VA is getting screwed over because of this
@pocalipse3408
S11 is my fav character in the game, I miss her voiceðŸ˜ðŸ˜ over all the ultimate "prepare to burn" don't feel the same passion
@antonimo_anonimo4499
thats sad to hear 😢, ZZZ is the first hoyo game i play with english dub on, because of how good the voice acting is.
@sevadra
I come from a school of thought for videogames as a whole medium of creative expression, that it is art, and all facets of involvement in creating a game experience is an art medium that allows creators of every role to give a spice of life to their games. Voice Acting is a huge proponent of this perspective, and throughout my life I have always looked at the experience that voice actors, musicians, level designers etc. have given to their games when you take into consideration the complete product being consumed. Videogames are a beautiful experience, and I think that this is a problem of taking this for granted. Sure, the price hikes and microtransactions issues of AAA games as a whole are their own entirely different problem of predatory marketing, and Gacha as a whole is in a similar vein, thats not my point: This is a step further of setting a precedent to "shortcut the creation experience" which in my opinion will significantly reduce the quality of life and creativity that video games as a whole have, were they to follow this example in the future. Voices play a large role in sending a message of any kind, and the idea that something so uniquely complex and beautiful can be synthesized at will... call me a purist, but as a consumer who deeply appreciates the time and effort people go through to make these experiences meld and feel complete, it terrifies me. I know I have a naïve and overly-passionate view on games as a whole in this regard, and the name of the game is money at the end of the day. Regardless, I hope that publishers find it in their hearts to understand the form of media they are contributing to.
@Franklin_Johanessan
I still have a lot of respect for S11's og VA, but the same can't be said for Lycaon's VA
@Quince03
So basically, if i don't go to work i can get replaced
@jjwang_safari0813
I hope the best for VAs standing their grounds, but this problem has been troubling our games for way too long. At some point Hoyo HAS to do something to ensure players' experiences, and as a player, I must say that I agree with Hoyo on this one. I simply can't wait forever and deal with unvoiced characters and stories. If they don't want to do their job, don't occupy the position and let somebody else do it. Also I don't know why this seems to be a EN-specific problem, all CN and JP VAs are working just fine and Hoyo has no intention or reason to replace any of them with AI anyways. Why are EN VA unions specifically worried about these issues?
@ziyusan
> Refuse to work > Publicly lie about being available to work > Get replaced Surprised pikachu face EN VAs are so problematic and couldn't have handled this any worse. I just switched to JP for good after S11's VA refused to voice her. The JP VAs are amazing
@code8825
I am concerned, I want voice actors to be treated properly, and just having a rotating door of new voices for characters doesn’t make a great playing experience. Hope this trend doesn’t continue Edit: also AI is evil I don’t trust it call me Ned Ludd
@Arkwing
Thanks for the Infos. But isn't there also the problem/topic of non-Union and union-members in the same project. Where at the end of it non-union Members are semi-forced to join the union. This whole thing is such an information swamp that I for myself came to the conclusion that I wish VAs all the best, hope Ai never replaces a true character (I am fine with Ai voices for sidecharacters/open world peasants) and probably switch to JP Voices. I feel like I can trust neither side. Not SAG nor the Gaming Industry
@KibaAzure